California Disappointment

[yensid]

Wait, toominnie, I thought you were done posting on this topic? What happened?

Am I the only one who noticed that "Marcie MI" first message was edited by "toominnie"? And that Marcie MI just registered yesterday?

Very tricky toominnie, that way you can post as two users to support your opinion. Marcie MI, who was "born and raised in California" to add validity to your "cause", then as "toominnie" the "dollmaker" who obviously lives out of state in Idaho and has only internet access to what DCA is.

I find your tactics . . . fascinating.

yensid

[DLMAGICDARREN]

All I can say at this point is it's common nature to have a predeveloped opinion if a park (or anything) will be good or bad. We all say we won't do it, but in reality we do. I have been excited for DCA for years. Overall I hope it will be a good park. I post positively about the park all the time, but I have not experianced it yet. Well that's about to change. I go later today.

I will be anxious to put up my thoughts on the park, be them good or bad thoughts, I am a Disney fan, but not blind to faults. I can spot the faults of Disneyland and I'm certain I will be able to spot the faults of DCA. I can also see the wonderful parts of a park. I think Universal parks are awesome, so it doesn't have to be a Disney park for me to have a good time and be excited. I also love Six Flags and Knotts, and others.

Nobody's opinion is right or wrong. Everybody has a different opinion, that's the diversity of our planet. There is a big diferrence in the defination of the words OPINION and FACT, some people think if their opinion is one way, then others are wrong.

Anyway let's keep the thread nice, it's fine to make your statements and rebuttals but nobody on this board better say another dam bad thiing about DCA. (LOL j/k)

------------------
Darren
Mouseinfo.com staff

January is the official welcome home Jen month at Mouseinfo.com

[yensid]

tominnie/MarcieMI, you really need to stop feeling sorry for me. I know that in Idaho you must have a lot of free time on your hands, but I really don't need your pity for my opinion.

You seem to have an issue with every thing I say, along with many other people who have posted opinions on my comments. I think those opinions are great and I find them interesting, until the become aggressive. We are all allowed our own opinion, however you continue to tell me, (and others), in your post as toominnie (and now your twin MarcieM) about my validity.

Well, let's talk about that for a second. I'm finding it truly interesting that a doll maker who attends the Meridian County Fair from Idaho has taken such an interest in my opinion and validity on DCA as a topic.

This is where true irony of what you have to say is apparent. I am getting a kick out of your comments regarding me as a negative person, someone who doesn't get Disney the way you do, and all the rest of the rhetoric you have spilled about me. Have you seen the book or the touring gallery exhibit "Designing Disney's Theme Parks: The Architecture of Reassurance'? I'm sure you have at least heard of it, being the Disney fan you say you are. Well as you look through the pages or recall your walk through that exhibit at the galleries in LA, New York, Paris,(I'm sure you have been to all of these places), you saw several examples of my work. Yes, that's right the person you said who "doesn't understand Disney the way you do" has been designing things for Disney for over 12 years now. Ironic isn't it. Many of the things you have come to love about Disney parks, I have been designing. I am finding it really funny that you, a lover of Disney, (as I am myself, why else would I be doing this for 12 years), have been bashing someone who has been making the environments you have been so viciously defending.

I am saddened about the way facts here have been re-addressed incorrectly by many people. In your latest post as MarcieMI you said DCA is the 2nd most expensive park by Disney in the US. Well that is only true if you lump the whole redevelopment of the Disneyland Resort into one price, which is 1.4 billion. Out of that amount, the budget for the new Theme Park, DCA, was to be 700 million. When the tally is in, it will be closer to more like 750-800 with cost over runs. So please, before you start spilling out "facts" you have only gathered from you extensive travels on the internet, make sure you verify them.

Now comes the next part, your bashing of my validity to my statement above. Well, for obvious reasons, I will not tell you my real name since I am still working for the big D. Of course you won't belive I am there anyway, but I don't care. It does not change the fact of where I work and what I do. But as I have stated before, your opinion is your opinion and has no effects on facts. You can choose to believe and support whatever you want. It is of no concern of mine. No matter how much twisting and manipulating you choose to do, it will have no effect on the facts of the new park or what I do at WDI.

Showman was completely correct on his assessment of all the "reasons" for the attraction mix of the park, as well as how attractions were chosen. No amount of post from people disputing the facts are going to change them. So, you can believe what you choose and rally behind those beliefs. What you believe is up to you and will not effect the realities and conditions of the DCA project.

DCA, as well as the rest of the Disneyland Resort expansion, was not made to provide Disney fans with something new and creative, it was designed and developed to make the Walt Disney Company money. It's that plain and simple. No amount of bickering on what you and others have heard is going to change that fact. You may not choose to except it, but that is your choice, not mine.

I know the truth and the truth is all that matters. If you read Showman's post with an open mind, you will become aware and know what all of us at WDI already know about the DCA project.

Showman, I'm very impressed with your knowledge of this project, drop me an e-mail I'd like to chat with you. Your post was the most accurate post on DCA I have seen in a long time on the internet.

yensid

[antny]

First of all I think its safe to say that Mouseinfo is a FAN site unlike mouseplanet which is a CRITIC site. Those of us who are regulars at mouseinfo enjoy the park because that is what it was intended for. Call it blindness, call it what you want. You dont have to ever go again if you dont like it. You can block it out of your mind or share your opinion with those at mouseplanet. You cant please all the people all the time. If you want to nickel and dime things about something that is suposed to bring us joy and an escape from the nickel and dimes outside the park gates, so be it but thats not what this site is about. We are not here to control your opinion but please dont rain on our parade. Go back to mouseplanet and ask for a discussion board where you can be negative and have pitty parties about ques and carny rides.

DCA is suposed to have carnival type rides. Thats a part of the theme.

Have you seen the que for matterhorn mountain? Its not all that themed and facinating either. Or how about the que for Small World or many of the Fantasyland rides? Not the most exciting of ques either. But we're not complaining about that are we?

Disneyland opened what 45 years ago? It's still not finished. The new park hasnt even opened yet and we are already complaining. The constant theme throughout Disney is "never finished." The things you dont like now, may change in the future so hold on to your girdle and hope for the best.

Nobody likes to hear a whiner.

[toominnie]

Now you have really made a fool of yourself Yensid HAHA. Anyone on this board knows you cannot edit someone else's post. MarcieMI was simply quoting what I wrote. I am ONLY toominnie but I do thank MarcieMI for her posts!!

P.S. I am also getting a kick out of the way that my one comment of feeling sorry for you was what really set you off in the beginning. You keep attacking me, where I now live, my life, etc...why do you even care if I feel sorry for you? It was just an innocent comment (my opinion)- I don't even know you.

P.P.S. You show how narrow minded you are by insinuating that because I now live in Idaho I may not have traveled. I have been to all of those places - have you? One other question do you always "dis" your employer? If you design for Disney why didn't you do something YOU liked at DCA?
[This message has been edited by toominnie (edited January 19, 2001).]

[This message has been edited by toominnie (edited January 19, 2001).]

[Jim Disney]

>>I am saddened about the way facts here have been re-addressed incorrectly by many people. In your latest post as MarcieMI you said DCA is the 2nd most expensive park by Disney in the US. Well that is only true if you lump the whole redevelopment of the Disneyland Resort into one price, which is 1.4 billion. Out of that amount, the budget for the new Theme Park, DCA, was to be 700 million. When the tally is in, it will be closer to more like 750-800 with cost over runs. So please, before you start spilling out "facts" you have only gathered from you extensive travels on the internet, make sure you verify them.<<

Well... the original projections for the project were $1.4 billion with DCA taking around $900 - $1 billion of that (don't believe me, go find the recent LA Times Articles on DCA). However, DCA has had some MAJOR cost over-runs to the tune of over $100 million. I have heard estimates of anywhere from $1.1 billion to $1.4 billion for the entire park. Fact is that is still more expensive than MGM or AK. Even at $900 million.

yensid, when are you going to reply to my rebuttal. I can't speak for everyone, but this personal bickering you and toominnie is getting to be annoying. You claim to have designed things for Disney. Where did you work in the company (if WDI, what department)? Having a little experience with the Mouse myself, I'd love to sit down and chat some time.

I'd love for you to give us some real reasons why DCA is so bad other than just regurgitating the same stuff we've seen on the DIG for a while now. Now that alot of people have seen the park, people are starting to see that those points are not really that valid. It is in no way a cheap park, the theming is top notch for the most part. Yes, even in Paradise Pier.... If you honestly feel that DCA is like a trip to the LA County Fair, I suggest you go visit the LA County Fair some time soon and see how wrong that statement is.

My only problems right now are with the Bountiful Valley Farm area, some areas where the sightlines are screwed up a bit. Superstar Limo and the Tortilla Factory should be embarrassed to call themselves Disney attractions. But other than that, I have no major issues. Paradise Pier is nice 'n' all, it's extremely well themed, the traffic problems I thought there would be are non-exsistant even on busier days. My only problem with Paradise Pier lies in Tim Delaney's somewhat fractured sense of place and time. It wasn't the most consistant art direction I've seen in a Disney park. But it's still 1000 times better than anything anyone else has out there. Other than that, I think the park works surprisingly well.

------------------
JD
http://www.westcoaster.net

[toominnie]

[This message has been edited by toominnie (edited January 19, 2001).]

[toominnie]

Originally posted by antny:
First of all I think its safe to say that Mouseinfo is a FAN site unlike mouseplanet which is a CRITIC site. Those of us who are regulars at mouseinfo enjoy the park because that is what it was intended for. Call it blindness, call it what you want. You dont have to ever go again if you dont like it. You can block it out of your mind or share your opinion with those at mouseplanet. You cant please all the people all the time. If you want to nickel and dime things about something that is suposed to bring us joy and an escape from the nickel and dimes outside the park gates, so be it but thats not what this site is about. We are not here to control your opinion but please dont rain on our parade. Go back to mouseplanet and ask for a discussion board where you can be negative and have pitty parties about ques and carny rides.

DCA is suposed to have carnival type rides. Thats a part of the theme.

Have you seen the que for matterhorn mountain? Its not all that themed and facinating either. Or how about the que for Small World or many of the Fantasyland rides? Not the most exciting of ques either. But we're not complaining about that are we?

Disneyland opened what 45 years ago? It's still not finished. The new park hasnt even opened yet and we are already complaining. The constant theme throughout Disney is "never finished." The things you dont like now, may change in the future so hold on to your girdle and hope for the best.

Nobody likes to hear a whiner.

Amen!

[raisun]

Ok, i'm feel like i should through in my 2 cents here since I went to DCA for the first time....

I loved it! Keeping in mind (and i don't think anyone here has mentioned it yet) these are still SOFT openings. meaning that there is still a lot of work to be done before the grand opening in a few weeks. I talked to a lot of my friends that work at the park while I was there, and the impression that I got was there is still a lot of things to get finished (detail work) before the opening.

Now Im not going to get involved in the arguments that have come previously in this post, but just want to say that I don't believe that DCA was a disappointment at all. There is quite a lot to do, in my opinion, and a lot to learn.

I was in the park off and on from 4:00 to midnight (except for a couple of trips to downtown disney for dinner and shopping), and there is still so much of the park that I didn't see (that I want to see), that I can't wait till I get the chance to go back!

[Briguy1314]

There is way to much personal attacking going on here. Yensid, toonminnie may disagree with you and even "feel sorry" for your opinion, but you dont need to attack where she lives and what she does! That is very uncalled for.
And Showman, there are many more Disney fans than just on this site....Many love Universal studios' IOA(I like it almost more then DL), and find that Disney can actually do some bad projects. Some may exhibit double standards, but dont lump all Disney fans together. I know I can appreciate good work, and avoid bad work, when i see it.