The Presidential Race 08

[1FoolishMortal]

You know why I don't like the way McCain is running his campaign? Because all he does is whine, campaign, whine, campaign, then whine some more. It started with the ridiculousness of him complaining that Obama was getting too much coverage in Europe, and it just got more hilarious from there. Remember after that when they were complaining that Obama was giving his acceptance speech in a baseball stadium? Guess where they're holding the RNC....a basketball arena of all places. Ironic, huh?

[Chavez Ravine]

Ok so on Friday I went wandering into the wilderness and got back Monday Night. Before I left I had heard a rumor that Palin had been chosen and that was it. I didn't realize that it would be such a huge issue. Here's my thoughts.

First, this was an incredible move by McCain. The person, the timing, masterful. I think that in general the VP's job is to simply get the candidate elected. Palin does that for McCain. She appeals to a younger demographic as well as obviously women. She also is conservative enough to satisfy the right wing which is what McCain's VP primarily needed to do. She also infused the campaign with excitement that it didn't have before.

Whether she is qualified is beyond the point. She already has accomplished those goals....which frankly makes her qualified for the role she has. Her job is to get McCain elected.

It also erases the McSame label that's going around. With this choice, McCain is showing that he is different from the traditional republican. It really is the first move in the campaign that shows his Marverick persona. It is a bold and risky move, but I think it's a move he had to make if he wants to win the election. It sets McCain up to be a person who could change Washington as well. Both sides have the same ticket in essense. McCain shows that he can embrace change even though he is ancient.

To top it off, McCain makes the announcement on the heels of the DNC and completely took the wind out of their sails. Really it was perfect.

It also highlights the fact that I think Barak made a mistake with the Biden pick. The Biden selection isn't the direction that his campaign was going. He was about fresh faces, change in washington and then he selects an insider. Your classic crusty white guy. If Obama had made a different selection say, hillary or the female gov. or kansas, even a Bill Richardson another minority, McCain's selection would have been seen as reactionary.

The last point that I find hilarious is that Palin is too inexperienced for VP. Really?!? So Barak's extra year in the Senate makes him qualified for President? The advantage of having Palin as the undercard is that she can gain experience on the job while Barak is the man from the start. McCain can still play the inexperience card, simply because compared to Barak he's much more experienced and really the race comes down to them.

Anyway, there's my armchair view..



Here's some other responses to posts...I think they are all Nemo's...love you sweetheart

Heres the Republican "pro life" candidate as she holds a semi-automatic weapon. Nothing says 'family values" and "life" like a gun!!

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Guns are a funny issue and frankly I think it a regional issue. In urban areas guns are for collecting, but in more rural areas guns are a way of life and a necessity. But owning a gun is not anti-family values of anti-pro-life.

I realize pro-life is a term used for abortion,but the whole idea of being pro-life is that you value life right? so how can you say you value life yet on weekends you go out with your rifle and hunt animals? I dunno,to me life is life no? seems a bit hypocritcal.

Did you really write this and think it was a valid arguement?

Cheating on his wife was not a national issue, thats between him and his family

I could buy this on some level. If I cheat on my wife my it shouldn't matter to my employer. However, if I cheat on my wife in my office at work...then it become an issue to my employer.

The evangelicals are going to looove this

Honestly, who do you think evangelicals are? You stereotype us and put us in a box of hate and intolerance when in reality you are ignorant of who we truly are.

If anyone's interested I'd love to discuss christianity within politics in a seperate thread.

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Couldn't the same thing be said about McCain Obama? Barak definately would look better in a swimsuit.

[cinder]

That Biden/Palin chart is the most insulting, sexist thing I have seen in a long time. Whomever made that should be ashamed of themselves.

[Mortimer]

I'm tired of the election.

[Snoopy]

I'm tired of the election.

I had to do a double take, I thought you said something else...

[Chavez Ravine]

That Biden/Palin chart is the most insulting, sexist thing I have seen in a long time. Whomever made that should be ashamed of themselves.

Yes, Yes it is.

That's one interesting thing about the Palin pick. There have been alot of sexist overtones from the liberal pundits...aka "liberal attack machine" (hehehe) which I find odd and inconsistant with their worldview.

[Sir_Cliff]

It also highlights the fact that I think Barak made a mistake with the Biden pick. The Biden selection isn't the direction that his campaign was going. He was about fresh faces, change in washington and then he selects an insider. Your classic crusty white guy. If Obama had made a different selection say, hillary or the female gov. or kansas, even a Bill Richardson another minority, McCain's selection would have been seen as reactionary.

I really disagree with this assessment of both choices.

On Obama´s side, the biggest problem he had was the question of inexperience which he was trying to counter with judgement. If he had of picked another outsider he would have increased the perceived risk of the ticket and I don´t think Barack Obama needs any more minority cred! If anything, a black guy and a woman or latino on the same ticket might begin to get just a little too much for a lot of voters unfortunately. With Hillary, the story for the rest of the campaign would have been how much they really hated each other and were just pretending to get along. Biden is an experienced guy who, whether people like him or not, most people would see as a qualified choice to take over the presidency should something happen to Barack or to be a sounding board for his policies.

McCain has with this pick undermined his own message of experience by himself picking someone with almost no experience to succeed him should something happen which puts the focus on Obama´s message of judgement. Looking at both of their choices, Palin is polling the lowest numbers of any vice presidential candidate in recent years except Dan Quayle on the question of being qualified to be president, with Gallop putting her at 39% thinking her qualified as opposed to 57% with Biden. Women, interestingly enough, are less likely to consider her qualified than men according to a CNN poll, with only around 25% seeing her as qualified. So who will voters think showed the most appropriate judgement in this case now that experience is almost completely off the table? Far more think Barack chose a qualified candidate for the job whereas McCain chose an unqualified candidate who is being highlighted as a purely strategic political choice. Hell, McCain had only even met her twice before naming her as his VP candidate!

She´s a good choice for getting the conservative base out, but overall I think McCain has really shot himself in the foot here and given Obama a decent chance of winning after the momentum seemed (to me anyway) to be heading in the other direction. So far, at any rate, he doesn´t seem to be getting any bounce from the choice: http://www.gallup.com/poll/109996/Ga...McCain-43.aspx

[Chavez Ravine]

I really disagree with this assessment of both choices.

On Obama´s side, the biggest problem he had was the question of inexperience which he was trying to counter with judgement. If he had of picked another outsider he would have increased the perceived risk of the ticket and I don´t think Barack Obama needs any more minority cred! If anything, a black guy and a woman or latino on the same ticket might begin to get just a little too much for a lot of voters unfortunately. With Hillary, the story for the rest of the campaign would have been how much they really hated each other and were just pretending to get along. Biden is an experienced guy who, whether people like him or not, most people would see as a qualified choice to take over the presidency should something happen to Barack or to be a sounding board for his policies.

McCain has with this pick undermined his own message of experience by himself picking someone with almost no experience to succeed him should something happen which puts the focus on Obama´s message of judgement. Looking at both of their choices, Palin is polling the lowest numbers of any vice presidential candidate in recent years except Dan Quayle on the question of being qualified to be president, with Gallop putting her at 39% thinking her qualified as opposed to 57% with Biden. Women, interestingly enough, are less likely to consider her qualified than men according to a CNN poll, with only around 25% seeing her as qualified. So who will voters think showed the most appropriate judgement in this case now that experience is almost completely off the table? Far more think Barack chose a qualified candidate for the job whereas McCain chose an unqualified candidate who is being highlighted as a purely strategic political choice. Hell, McCain had only even met her twice before naming her as his VP candidate!

She´s a good choice for getting the conservative base out, but overall I think McCain has really shot himself in the foot here and given Obama a decent chance of winning after the momentum seemed (to me anyway) to be heading in the other direction. So far, at any rate, he doesn´t seem to be getting any bounce from the choice: http://www.gallup.com/poll/109996/Ga...McCain-43.aspx

I can see that perspective. The thing with Biden is that he's so established as a washington insider historically. If Barak would have gone with anyone else it would have been a better choice in terms of his message. (I thought Warner from VA would be a good choice). Or even an older Govenor rather than a Senator.

In Terms of Palin and the public perception, her speech tonight will be important as it'll be the first time people get to see her. If she knocks it out of the park then I think you'll see those numbers rise. The VP debate will be important. I think there's more upside with her than anyone else.

The fact remains that McCain's camp is now the primary topic of conversation. It hasn't been that way ever within the campaign. Palin has taken her lumps but if she hits back and is successful in the public eye it's a winner.

Edit: I'm looking at this more from a strategic standpoint rather than a long term best for the office standpoint.

[Banjalot]

I'm voting republican.

[Sir_Cliff]

I can see that perspective. The thing with Biden is that he's so established as a washington insider historically. If Barak would have gone with anyone else it would have been a better choice in terms of his message. (I thought Warner from VA would be a good choice). Or even an older Govenor rather than a Senator.

You could be right, but I suspect he perhaps needed to add a bit of an ´establishment´ flavour to his ticket just because the main line of attack has been that he´s too untested and just all about airy fairy talk of change without having ever achieved anything. With Biden Obama gets a familiar face with a long record that people apparently think equals competence.

In Terms of Palin and the public perception, her speech tonight will be important as it'll be the first time people get to see her. If she knocks it out of the park then I think you'll see those numbers rise. The VP debate will be important. I think there's more upside with her than anyone else.

I think both will matter, but I think it will be hard to get over a few fundamentals regarding her experience however well she comes across. She strikes me as very likable and intelligent but I don´t think it will be enough. We shall see, though!

Edit: I'm looking at this more from a strategic standpoint rather than a long term best for the office standpoint.

Same here. For whatever reason I do find campaign strategy quite interesting though often demoralising and frustrating!